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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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 Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:52 am Post subject: 2.2 Details. |
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| MOAR SCIENCE!! |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| This looks fun! |
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Finger
Forum Veteran
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 870
Location: Churchill, On
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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The subassembly system will be a welcome addition. I've been using the
mod but it's a bit ungainly.
And the science element is going to be a big boon. I have a plan
inspired by a forward-thinking politician.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6Y4B3tU_t8 |
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Finger
Forum Veteran
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 870
Location: Churchill, On
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Its arrived, and the career mode is just awesome, finally some goal to reach for. |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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| This is cool. It's simple yet strangely addictive. I've only done 2 missions to open the first to tiers of SCIENCE! Exciting times we live in. |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:29 am Post subject: |
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| The career mode is making me use parts that I've initially discounted. I find it very cool being forced to make rockets with limited parts as it really pushes you to be efficient, not only in the rocket design but also the flying. Also, doing science with limited electrical charges is challenging. I was finding myself making orbital maneuvers just to build electrical charge to transmit data. |
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:34 am Post subject: |
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| yes, i'm finding it challenging, i like the challenge though, unlocking solar panels is tonight's goal. might even try and land on the moon aswell. |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| Dynamite Dan wrote: | | yes, i'm finding it challenging, i like the challenge though, unlocking solar panels is tonight's goal. might even try and land on the moon aswell. |
I'm two levels in, i have landing struts unlocked - can I land on the moon? |
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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Land is such a vague term, you could carry out a controlled impact with the surface, but i wouldn't call it "landing"!  |
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Finger
Forum Veteran
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 870
Location: Churchill, On
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| Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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I've made it to the Mun without landing, however I underestimated the fuel required to return and have stranded Jebediah in very high Kerbin orbit. So until I unlock the three seat cockpit he will up there gathering data.
Have you guys found carrying extra "Mystery Goo" increases the science output? I usually put two pods on the capsule for the sake of balance, but I'm not sure if observing both pods garners better results.
I've also discovered that bigger is not better. As promised, aerodynamics seem to play an important part in rocket design now. I mounted stacks of fuel containers (each with a rocket engine) to the central fuel stack, and several SRBs to them and learned two things:
1. Struts connected between the external fuel stacks and the central stack act as the fuel lines did. It seems fuel flows toward the central fuel containers thus allowing the external fuel tanks to be jettisoned when they are empty and the central tanks will still be full. I assumed that since they are fuel crossfeed capable that the fuel would even out, but that does not seem to be the case.
2. Adding a crapload of boosters and rockets seems to return negative results. That is, the ship does not seem to go any higher and instead a longer, narrower ship seems to go further than a shorter wider one with lots of engines.
I also found a thread on the steam forums stating that doing EVA reports and observing the Goo everywhere and taking soil samples from all over Kerbit are key in climbing the research ladder efficiently.
Any thoughts?
Theory:
Method:
Observations:
Conclusions: |
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Finger
Forum Veteran
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 870
Location: Churchill, On
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:25 am Post subject: |
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| Finger wrote: | I've made it to the Mun without landing, however I underestimated the fuel required to return and have stranded Jebediah in very high Kerbin orbit. So until I unlock the three seat cockpit he will up there gathering data.
Have you guys found carrying extra "Mystery Goo" increases the science output? I usually put two pods on the capsule for the sake of balance, but I'm not sure if observing both pods garners better results.
I've also discovered that bigger is not better. As promised, aerodynamics seem to play an important part in rocket design now. I mounted stacks of fuel containers (each with a rocket engine) to the central fuel stack, and several SRBs to them and learned two things:
1. Struts connected between the external fuel stacks and the central stack act as the fuel lines did. It seems fuel flows toward the central fuel containers thus allowing the external fuel tanks to be jettisoned when they are empty and the central tanks will still be full. I assumed that since they are fuel crossfeed capable that the fuel would even out, but that does not seem to be the case.
2. Adding a crapload of boosters and rockets seems to return negative results. That is, the ship does not seem to go any higher and instead a longer, narrower ship seems to go further than a shorter wider one with lots of engines.
I also found a thread on the steam forums stating that doing EVA reports and observing the Goo everywhere and taking soil samples from all over Kerbit are key in climbing the research ladder efficiently.
Any thoughts?
Theory:
Method:
Observations:
Conclusions: |
I like that you're in a situation to unlock parts simply to attempt a rescue, that is kinda cool. I had a similar mission: I was able to get to Minmus and was on final approach for a nice landing when I ran out of power. Turns out the engines I was using do not generate electricity and I hadn't unlocked batteries yet. So there's Jeb, sitting in his capsule and no way to orient himself for landing, what to do? Eject Eject Eject! I was able to use the RCS system on Jeb's pack to make a soft landing. He even planted a flag and took a soil sample.
I was able to create a tandem rocket with a spare 1-kerbin pod that I took to Minimus to affect a rescue. I ended up landing safely back on Kerbin with two soil samples from this mission. I made a lot of SCIENCE!
1. Do you think it is a bug that the struts are allowing you to do crossfeeding of fuel?
2. So did they make changes to the aerodynamics with the last patch? I had heard tell that they were not calculating drag correctly and you didn't need to add the nose cones to the top of exposed boosters. In previous version, asparagus staging was the best way to get to orbit since unlike in the real world where there would be too much aero drag. Unfortunately I find that building tall rockets makes them really flimsy and It's too bad that the connections between parts aren't stronger to not allow all this flex.
A soil sample from Minmus can net ~300 science points.
Question: Is it better to hold on to science reports instead of transmitting them? |
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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On my last mission i put about 8 Goo-pods on and 2 of those other science parts, (forget the name of them but part of them opens up to expose the insides)
Anyway, the way science works is in biomes, each celestial body has multiple biomes., So, the way i do things is, keep transmitting a crew report from different biomes, High Kerbin atmosphere, low orbit, high orbit, orbit around another body, and on the surface of another body.
When orbiting the moon, i was to get 70 science from each goo pod, so i kept all those and the crew report and science capsules and returned to kerbin with >600 science.
Remember that if you want to transmit data you only get a percentage of the science value, but this can be offset by keep collecting data in different situations and sending it. |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| How do you know when you're in which biome? |
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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you dont, well accurately anyway. Even in orbit at 90K your Kerbal mentions different locations above the surface on his EVA report, such as Above mountains, above arctic, above wasteland, above plains etc etc so your location is vital. I haven't managed to get to deep space yet and i know that another "area"
Minmus next |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Cool thanks. I guess I need to read those reports to see if they're new. |
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Finger
Forum Veteran
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 870
Location: Churchill, On
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| Posted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Super Wabbit wrote: |
I like that you're in a situation to unlock parts simply to attempt a rescue, that is kinda cool. I had a similar mission: I was able to get to Minmus and was on final approach for a nice landing when I ran out of power. Turns out the engines I was using do not generate electricity and I hadn't unlocked batteries yet. So there's Jeb, sitting in his capsule and no way to orient himself for landing, what to do? Eject Eject Eject! I was able to use the RCS system on Jeb's pack to make a soft landing. He even planted a flag and took a soil sample.
I was able to create a tandem rocket with a spare 1-kerbin pod that I took to Minimus to affect a rescue. I ended up landing safely back on Kerbin with two soil samples from this mission. I made a lot of SCIENCE!
1. Do you think it is a bug that the struts are allowing you to do crossfeeding of fuel?
2. So did they make changes to the aerodynamics with the last patch? I had heard tell that they were not calculating drag correctly and you didn't need to add the nose cones to the top of exposed boosters. In previous version, asparagus staging was the best way to get to orbit since unlike in the real world where there would be too much aero drag. Unfortunately I find that building tall rockets makes them really flimsy and It's too bad that the connections between parts aren't stronger to not allow all this flex.
A soil sample from Minmus can net ~300 science points.
Question: Is it better to hold on to science reports instead of transmitting them? |
I hadn't considered adding an extra pod and removing the crew from it. I assumed that since the description says you need a minimum of 1 crew member it was for each pod. But if I can add a second one I don't need the 3 man pod. Thanks for the tip!
I also hadn't considered landing on the Mun or Minmus since there are no ladders and I was thinking in terms of Kerbal gravity. Clearly I have to get out of the sandbox mentality and focus harder on efficiency.
As for aerodynamics, I know that in the 0.21 patch the nosecones only added weight without function. But in the 0.22 patch I recall reading that they would be necessary and that asparagus staging would be too inefficient to continue using.
One way fuel flow with the struts seems to be a bug. Though I haven't tried manually moving fuel in both directions, it looks like the ship controlled fuel flow should make fuel burn from all stacks evenly as when there are no fuel lines.
I'm impressed with your progress guys. I'll see if I can get Jeb back and then start exploring the various celestial bodies. |
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Super Wabbit
CH Administrator
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 3667
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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At least for low-gravity moons like minmus and mun, you don't need a latter. In-fact, you can reach escape velocity with just an RCS pack...
I can see my house from here! |
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Dynamite Dan
Deputy
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 4299
Location: Blackburn, Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 4:59 am Post subject: |
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| Finger wrote: |
One way fuel flow with the struts seems to be a bug. Though I haven't tried manually moving fuel in both directions, it looks like the ship controlled fuel flow should make fuel burn from all stacks evenly as when there are no fuel lines.
I'm impressed with your progress guys. I'll see if I can get Jeb back and then start exploring the various celestial bodies. |
You do know that fuel flow is one way on the fuel lines? it moves from the first click to the second click when placing the lines. Tanks just connected by struts wont transfer fuel between one another unless you do it manually. |
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